If you think about what you’re here to do in life, the answer is probably not ‘get really good at time management’.

That’s Jocelyn K. Glei after interviewing Oliver Burkeman on this unmissable podcast episode, “Against Time Management.” She adds, “Maybe getting overly obsessed about time management is really just a sleight of hand. One which we spend all our energy focusing on a difficult task that we will inevitably never succeed at – in this case, controlling time — as a distraction from the more difficult task of confronting what we’re really here on earth to do.” Take your time getting there, but do hurry to listen to the episode in its entirety.